OT: Urban decay...

[Methem]

Nothing to do with music, but...

I have this thing for old buildings and other urban structures, abandoned or active. I've seen some of the photo galleries from Detroit, and just like many other people, I was especially fascinated by the fate of the Michigan Central Station:

http://www.forgottendetroit.com/mcs/photos.html

Any interesting comments, thoughts about this? I wonder if they're eventually going to demolish the building.

Other stuff:

http://www.derelictlondon.com/


-Methem

[roger]

wow. what a place. an absolute shame to tear it down...

thanks for the links, Methem.

[Methem]

No problem, Roger.

Just found these:

http://www.detroitfunk.com/2006/06/back_to_motown.html
http://forgottenmichigan.com/gallery...ished/donovan/


-Methem

[Methem]

http://russos.livejournal.com/210363.html

Quite a place...


-Methem

[mailotron]

I meant OT: Urban decay was a new Ozric Tentacles 's CD

[Methem]

Originally Posted by mailotron

I meant OT: Urban decay was a new Ozric Tentacles 's CD

"OT" was supposed to mean "Off-Topic".

But if Ozrics were to make such an album, perhaps it would be their first to explore the darker, melancholic side of music. I wonder how that would sound...


-Methem

[jtmckinley]

Well, I live in the Detroit suburbs so you'd think I'd actually know something about this, but I hardly ever get downtown unless there's a music event I want to see down there (went to the Hoedown once to see some friends play there, but that's all I've been to) or family comes in and wants to go to "Greek Town" (which is a joke IMHO compared to say the ethnic "towns" of Chicago or SF or whatever, Greek town is 2 blocks long and across the street from a casino) so I've not been down there much. Fact is, downtown Detroit doesn't have all that much to offer (compared to say Chicago where I used to live) IMHO.

I didn't grow up in the Detroit area though, so there may still be a lot that I'm not aware of in this area (it *is* MOTOWN after all, the birthplace of all those great R&B recordings, and there's still an active music scene, not prog that I'm aware of, but techno is the current claim to fame that I'm aware of), but one feature of Detroit is the exodus of gainfully employed people away from the city Detroit over the years. The Detroit area has a series of "rings" as people migrated away from the city (I live in a 3rd ring suburb and live < 1 mile from where I work) and apparently many businesses also moved/built their headquarters outside the city. The end result is that Detroit proper is really struggling since there isn't a sufficient tax base to even provide proper essential services such as water and sewage treatment, or so I've heard. The 1st "ring" is also in trouble from what I've heard due to declining property values.

Actually, the whole area is having trouble right now with Ford and GM (the two largest employers IIRC) having major difficulties right now; many of my friends/colleagues have seen the values of their homes decrease even out in the third "ring". Fortunately I live in an old (circa 1950-1960) neighborhood that is still desirable, but even so, my property values have only gone up about 1% in my first year here and it is relatively expensive to buy a house out here in the third ring, not as bad as say Silicon Valley where some friends live, but about twice what it costs in the St. Louis, MO suburbs where I grew up.

As far as the building referenced above being destroyed, I've not heard anything about it, and although there is an effort to revitalize downtown Detroit, I doubt the city has the money to demolish the building, so maybe it's safe LOL. Of course if some developer comes along with some cash and wants that site I wouldn't be surprised to see them get it and what they'd do with it is anybody's guess, but it wouldn't surprise me if they razed it in order to build a mall or another casino or whatever, which would be a shame, but I don't have any additional information regarding it's fate, sorry...

[Methem]

Originally Posted by jtmckinley

Fact is, downtown Detroit doesn't have all that much to offer (compared to say Chicago where I used to live) IMHO.

Perhaps they've already demolished most of what's worth looking at in the city...

http://detroityes.com/index.html has some photo tours of the city. Click "Tour the ruins" to view them.

I didn't grow up in the Detroit area though, so there may still be a lot that I'm not aware of in this area (it *is* MOTOWN after all, the birthplace of all those great R&B recordings, and there's still an active music scene, not prog that I'm aware of, but techno is the current claim to fame that I'm aware of),

Detroit is usually credited for being the place were "techno" was pretty much born, created by the guys like Juan Atkins and Derrick May. The city is also the home of Underground Resistance, aka UR, a more or less famous techno collective.

but one feature of Detroit is the exodus of gainfully employed people away from the city Detroit over the years. The Detroit area has a series of "rings" as people migrated away from the city (I live in a 3rd ring suburb and live < 1 mile from where I work) and apparently many businesses also moved/built their headquarters outside the city. The end result is that Detroit proper is really struggling since there isn't a sufficient tax base to even provide proper essential services such as water and sewage treatment, or so I've heard. The 1st "ring" is also in trouble from what I've heard due to declining property values.

Actually, the whole area is having trouble right now with Ford and GM (the two largest employers IIRC) having major difficulties right now; many of my friends/colleagues have seen the values of their homes decrease even out in the third "ring". Fortunately I live in an old (circa 1950-1960) neighborhood that is still desirable, but even so, my property values have only gone up about 1% in my first year here and it is relatively expensive to buy a house out here in the third ring, not as bad as say Silicon Valley where some friends live, but about twice what it costs in the St. Louis, MO suburbs where I grew up.

Shrinking Cities has some information about that sort of development, very prevalent in post-industrial areas. It's a cultural project (with a somewhat confusing website):

http://www.shrinkingcities.com/index.php?L=1
http://www.shrinkingcities.com/standorte0.0.html?&L=1
http://www.shrinkingcities.com/kultu...en.0.html?&L=1

As far as the building referenced above being destroyed, I've not heard anything about it, and although there is an effort to revitalize downtown Detroit, I doubt the city has the money to demolish the building, so maybe it's safe LOL. Of course if some developer comes along with some cash and wants that site I wouldn't be surprised to see them get it and what they'd do with it is anybody's guess, but it wouldn't surprise me if they razed it in order to build a mall or another casino or whatever, which would be a shame, but I don't have any additional information regarding it's fate, sorry...

Yep...

Thanks for the post: it's good to hear from someone who actually lives there.


-Methem

[Methem]

A few photos more or less suitable for this thread:

http://www.student.oulu.fi/~miputkon/photos.html


-Methem

[roger]

http://www.student.oulu.fi/~miputkon...m_mill2007.jpg

what a great building.

thanks, Methem.

[Methem]

Originally Posted by roger

http://www.student.oulu.fi/~miputkon...m_mill2007.jpg

what a great building.

When I first saw it, it was love at first sight, so to speak. There is something special in these old red brick buildings.

Some background and other photos of this particular building can be found on http://www.dm-exp.org/gallery/oulu_m...ulu_mylly.html

For an excellent site with photography of old industrial buildings (some real classics), see http://www.hfinster.de/ by the way.


-Methem

[roger]

fabulous links! now all I need are several days to browse...

[Methem]

Originally Posted by roger

fabulous links! now all I need are several days to browse...

Or much more:

http://www.hfinster.de/StahlArt2/Links-en.html




-Methem

[roger]

oh man.

my life as I know it is over...

[Methem]

Originally Posted by roger

oh man.

my life as I know it is over...

Hopefully not. But there's indeed quite a lot of material related to old architecture and "urban exploration" available on the Net, it seems. An interesting resource I've totally forgotten to post is the collection of links on the Infiltration.org site:

http://www.infiltration.org/resources-links.html

There's a map, and you can browse sites by location. Too bad many locations/states/countries only have like one or two links available. Also some of the web sites having to do with urban exploration really can be a bit, well, childish.


-Methem

[roger]

more great stuff.

I've been spending some time today thinking about "why do I like this stuff?"

not sure that I have an answer, but it sure does fascinate me.

it's like modern historical dinosaurs, or something...

[Methem]

Originally Posted by roger

more great stuff.

I've been spending some time today thinking about "why do I like this stuff?"

not sure that I have an answer, but it sure does fascinate me.

it's like modern historical dinosaurs, or something...

I don't have an exact answer either. One of the reasons for liking this sort of stuff is that I'm sometimes interested in history in general, and old buildings, whether industrial or something else, certainly have something to tell about the past. And then there's just something fascinating, and at the same time scary, in seeing these old, abandoned places and how the nature is slowly reclaiming them. Probably the dinosaur thing you're talking about...

Old buildings, old cars, and other old things in general are often more sympathetic than their modern counterparts, from the aesthetic point of view. All these corporate "glass palaces" nauseate me; new cars largely lack personality (for rather practical and good reasons of course, but anyway); people think CDs obviously don't quite have the same feeling as vinyls (plus turntablists can scratch with vinyls, not with CDs ); and so on. I also think liking these old things might be some sort of counter reaction against the current hectic life and what often seems to be so blind, short-sighted progress. Things are changing too fast for many people to adapt. I'm not a conservative, but you need at least some stability, some "roots", something to attach to (hopefully not to harmful extent though). Just like you need certain people and their characteristics and want those people to remain around as long as possible. Something like that...

I'm not against progress, but we need to consider our moves carefully, not the way a certain bloated corporation develops its software.


-Methem

[Methem]

Added a couple of photos I had in store to my page. Nothing special though.

-Methem

[roger]

some great stuff here:

http://www.hebig.org/photos/

[Methem]

Originally Posted by roger

some great stuff here:

http://www.hebig.org/photos/

Thanks for the link. Will take a detailed look at it.

There seem to be quite a lot photos related to steel industry on those pages. I spent three summers working at a large cold-rolling mill. I never visited the melting shop or the hot-rolling mill in that particular factory though, which I've since regretted. But of course the cold-rolling mill alone was very interesting. Both impressive and somewhat scary, considering all the big machinery and automation there.

Here's a rather poor photo from the same mill:
http://network.ilehti.com/midcom-ser...02tornio_2.jpg

showing some coils (usually around 18000-20000kg), automatic guided vehicles and a crane.


-Methem